Kelsea Ballerini’s Patterns Is Not Not A Love Album

When I meet up with Kelsea Ballerini for coffee, it’s a crisp fall day in New York City. It’s early October, and we’re mere blocks away from Madison Square Garden, where she’ll perform for the first time on Oct. 29 for a sold-out album-release show. That album — her fifth, titled Patterns — will come out on Oct. 25. I ask her if she’s ready to start the inevitable chaos and nonstop grind that comes with an album release. “Oh, we’re in it,” she says.

Needless to say, she’s ready. And with one listen, you can hear why: This is Ballerini at her best, with all the catchiness of a pop-country superstar of her caliber and a continued evolution of her abilities as a songwriter. At 31, fresh off her Saturn return and in love, it’s Ballerini at her most confident yet. “I feel less pressure,” she says of promoting the album. “I'm just having fun chatting. I'm kind of like, ‘What is the gauge of success? What do I need from this?’ I really just want to tour a record that hopefully people like. MSG is my litmus test, and that went well as far as people showing up. So I just hope people like it.”

Here, Ballerini discuss some of her favorite songs from the album, strengthening her relationships, and not comparing herself to others.

How are you feeling about the album? It's so good.

Do you like it?

I really love it. It's so catchy, too.

Thank God.

It feels very adult. Very “this is how I feel” in a matter-of-fact way.

It's very accepting. It's like even when I'm feeling chaotic and even when I'm pointing the finger at myself like, “Oh, this is my fault,” there's still an acceptance in it. Where I'm like, “I'm not going to shame myself for this feeling or this moment. It is what it is and we're going to move forward.” I'm glad you feel that.

It's what I feel like everyone in their 20s and 30s is feeling. It's like I poked my head up for air when I turned 30 and I was like, “OK, all right. Here's my life. What do I like? What do I not like? What have I contributed to both? What do I need to edit? What do I need to celebrate?” And then let me do the exact same thing with everyone close to me. That's what it is.

Is this your Saturn return album?

It's so funny that you say that. I almost named Subject to Change, my album before Rolling Up the Welcome Mat, Saturn Returns. I felt like that was my Saturn return. I think I'm over it.

Let’s talk the single “Sorry Mom” — what is that song to you?

“Sorry Mom” is just in my brain. My intention was to write a love letter to my mom, to our relationship now, which has very much so shifted from mother and daughter to woman to woman. Being able to talk about all the things that, generationally, in that pattern of family, her and her mom didn't talk about and her mom didn't talk about. And I think being able to open conversation about all that is, it's definitely been celebratory for our relationship.

When did you feel the shift in the relationship?

Genuinely Saturn return. In every area of my life from 28 to 30, I have felt everything. It's almost like a shedding of your skin. People say that when you turn 30 as a woman, something happens for you just like you give away less of your power to other people to give it back. You keep it, and I do feel that, but it has to come in doses, and I think it comes through a lot of that... I don't know, the growing pains of those last few years of your 20s. I lived with my mom in essentially her in-law suite in her attic when I was going through my divorce, and I feel like that was really the turning point for us. I was like, “Mama, this is where it's at.” You can't hide that.

And so why this song for the first single?

Well, I used to think that the best way to promo a record is find the song that's the hit-iest or find the song that's going to pop off on TikTok, and I didn't want to do that for this record, which everyone thinks it's just a slow-driving record right now, which it's not. There are bops, but—

Reader, there are plenty of bops.

There are bops. But I wanted to put out the story first. “Sorry Mom,” “Two Things,” and then “First Rodeo.” To me, those are some of the stories thematically that I want people to hear. And then when people hear the record, then you'll have the “Baggage” and then “We Broke Up” and the “Wait!” and then “I Would, Would You” and all that stuff I love, and I loved writing those songs and I feel like live, that's all I want to play. But I don't want the songwriting to get lost.

“We Broke Up” is really fun.

I love it. I wrote that in the Bahamas with the girls on our final trip for writing, and I kind of wanted to make fun of myself because I love a breakup song, and I just had put out an EP going through every detail of the biggest kind of breakup you can have. I was like, “How do we make fun of me and kind of show the undoing of that pattern of writing every detail of something and just being like, ‘What is the simplest bad-bitch-energy version of that that we can do?’”

It’s so unexpected. Do you think a lot of people are going to go into this album expecting a love record from top to bottom?

Yeah. And it's not not a love record. But I feel like even with “Two Things,” everyone's like, "Wait, who is this about?" And I'm like, "Guys, this is a love song." It's just about the nuance of love. It's about a part of love you have to address before you really get deeper into it. And I think the whole record takes you through a very real journey of people that come together that have relational history and public relational history and different upbringings and different family dynamics and all these things, and you come together as adults and you have lives to sort through to be able to build one together. And to me, that is the most appealing part of love, sorting through all that and finding those dynamics that you're able to undo those patterns together. And I think it's a love record. It's just probably not what people are expecting.

It’s an adult love record in realizing that part of love is the disagreements and then finding your way through the disagreements.

Yes. And that to me is so hot. Where I've gotten to in my relationship is that we move as a team in a unit, but we got there because of two years of really having to figure it out together, as does everyone. So I feel really proud to be able to have written about it and to be supported in that.

Your last EP was incredibly blunt in laying out “Here is what I went through.” Do you think this one is just as autobiographical?

It's super autobiographical. And it's in order. I love a record that brings me on a journey, so I wanted to make a record that gives people the same thing. I think if you listen to it top to bottom, which I hope people do, it brings you through a beginning of questioning yourself, into questioning everything in your life, into a resolution of, through all that, there's been a lot of growth and it feels beautiful, and I'm really proud of myself and I'm proud of people I love, and I wonder what's next.

You keep it open-ended.

Always. I'm still writing.

How’d you know you were done with this record then?

Oh, because it was past due. I was literally sliding more songs in at the last minute. The last song I put on there is called “Wait!” and it's one of my absolute favorites.

Let’s talk MSG. I am so excited for you.

It was not my idea, but when they were like, "Hey, do you want to do MSG for album release?" I mean, first of all, yes, duh. But second of all, to put up an arena on sale for an album that's not even out yet after I haven't been touring for a year with all-new production feels terrifying. So I was very intimidated, but it's going to be great. We've done the music rehearsals, and the music feels so yummy live. And then production rehearsals are next week, and it's a full big-girl production. It's like a whole night.

How many outfit changes?

Four.

Is it going to be what the tour will be?

Similar, but not the same. Not the same because we wanted One Night Only to feel like one night only… Tour will be 40 dates across the U.S., in arenas. It's insane. I mean, that's always been my dream. I grew up going to arena shows and seeing women in arenas. I think women putting on a show, we care so much about the atmosphere. What is the feeling I want people to step into? And I think arenas are just the best room to do it in because it's controlled. Being able to just identify the feelings I want people to be able to have in that kind of show is so fun.

How do you want people to feel?

I want people to feel whatever they want, but connected to themselves, who they're with, us on stage, whatever. Even if they go alone.

I saw you just went to the Sweat tour?

I went in Nashville. I don't really know the Brat situation, but I was vibing. I'm a massive Troye Sivan fan. I knew every single song of his. Troye Sivan is my celebrity crush. He's just so beautiful and so talented. It felt like I was in a club. I feel like it was louder than any show I've seen at Bridgestone.

They brought out Lorde when I saw them at MSG, and I thought the building was going to collapse.

I'd like her to make another record. I love her records. Melodrama is still my favorite.

I feel like she’s been teasing new music for a while!

Really? Get it out! Just not on Oct. 25, please.

Who have you seen perform at MSG before?

I saw Harry Styles twice, and I saw SZA, which was one of my favorite shows I've ever seen in my life. The visuals were so beautiful. That record really was that for me.

That was her Saturn return album!

That was her Saturn return. That was the record I listened to the most when I was making Welcome Mat, going through all that.

What did you listen to when making this album?

Lo-fi. I barely listened to any lyrical music. I never, ever want to hear something and be like, “Oh, that was a cool idea” and then accidentally have it filed away. But I do like to know what's going on. I'm listening to Sabrina [Carpenter] right now. But other than that, especially when you're promoting a record, I don't want to get in my head about what else is out there because I'm a girl and I'm going to start comparing myself. I don't want to do that. There's no space for that.

What are you most excited for at MSG?

I have a lift.

Your dream!

I've said that for 10 years and literally I've told everyone, and I'm telling you this, too: I need everyone that I know to not be in my eyeline because if I see you and I'm coming up on a lift, I'm going to look at you and I will break character in two seconds. All my hometown friends and stuff, I'm like, “I'm putting you in a suite. I can't see you. I literally can't see you.”

Actually, my favorite moment of the show is going to be the outro. The whole video wall, which is massive, turns into New York. And I have a back staircase, and it's going to turn into a subway. And so I'm just going to walk down to the subway and leave the stage. That'll be really cool. And then there's a song called “Deep” that is very much so giving... The first line is “Standing in my underwear,” and I will be doing that. So sorry, Mom.

I mean, you already did it on the cover of NYLON.

You're right. I sometimes come across the video where I was walking down to set that day, and I have my hands covering my booty. Now I'm like, “Shit. I'm about to do it at MSG.” And that's on growth.

This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.